Wisconsin recently became the 49th State to pass a concealed carry law and Pat Quinn immediately voiced his opposition to passing a similar law in Illinois. In support of his blind opposition to concealed carry, Quinn cited three surveys from various anti-gun groups that supposedly showed that Illinois residents don’t support the carrying of concealed weapons.
Interestingly enough, the survey data that was used to come up with this bold conclusion is suspiciously unavailable, a fact which Quinn, Chicago politicians, and the various Chicago media outlets have chosen to ignore. If these anti gun groups were so sure of their position, that Illinois residents don’t support concealed carry, why aren’t they flaunting their data for the world to see?
The answer is simple: their data is flawed. I can only speculate, but I suspect the majority of the data came from various web surveys posted on notoriously anti-gun websites to skew the results. I say, “suspect” because the data isn’t available for a 3rd party to analyze.
In contrast, data from pro gun groups is widely available on the Internet. The pro gun data shows that in every state where a concealed carry law was passed, violent crime decreased. Anti gun activists try to come up with data to show the contrary, but they generally can’t come up with anything other than hyperbole and hypothetical situations.
I challenge anti gun activists to come up with a better argument than “What if someone gets angry while carrying a gun?” Questions like this are just admissions that anti gun activists have no data to support their position. Instead of asking this hypothetical question, how about showing the world some data that shows that concealed carry permit holders get angry and shoot people? (What’s that? No data here either? Has it mysteriously disappeared as well?)
I pose this question to Pat Quinn and his Chicago supporters: Are the other 49 States the Wild West? (Wild West shootouts being the “go to” hypothetical reference that all Quinn and his cronies like to use to sensationalize their anti gun position.)
Obviously, the answer to my above question is, “No.”
Do Miami residents fear daily gun battles on South Beach from gun toting concealed carry permit holders? Of course they don’t. (If you google “gun battle on South Beach” you will find references to rival drug dealers and gangs shooting at each other, just like Chicago or any other large city, but not a single reference to a concealed carry permit holder shooting at another.)
Quinn’s opposition to concealed carry is simply irrational and unfounded. Quinn perpetrates a ridiculous fear of guns, mostly based on “facts” pulled from movies and other sensational references. Florida has several large cities, all with gangs, drugs, and all of the other typical “big city” problems that you would expect from large cities, but what the Florida cities don’t share is a murder rate anywhere near that of Chicago.
If there’s one place in the world that desperately needs concealed carry, it’s Illinois, especially areas like Chicago and Rockford. (Rockford recently made the top 10 list for most dangerous cities in the United States.)
The people of Illinois deserve the right to defend themselves. The Supreme Court has already determined that the Second Amendment is an individual right and specifically found that people have the right to own a handgun in their home for self-defense in McDonald v. Chicago.
Illinois is already embarrassingly behind the times on its gun laws, let’s not wait for the Supreme Court to tell the State that it is wrong on its concealed carry ban, just as Chicago was wrong on its handgun ban.
-Alan Kaufman
I don't feel you've thought this through carefully. There's more involved in the entire situation regarding guns than your are presenting. Let's pretend for a moment that your argument does hold some merit, and that places with conceal/carry laws actually do see violent crime reduction. [*those* numbers are also suspect, by the way] Have you bothered to also look at what *other* statitistics exist? Let's see, such as the amount of firearms that accidentally fall into children's hands and cause otherwise preventable deaths/maimings(?) Yeah, you missed that one, didn't you? If the conceal/carry law on the books in FL is so effective at protecting citizens, why are the drug dealers still willingly shooting at each other on a public beach(?) One of the biggest arguments by the pro-gun side is that being able to carry a concealed weapon is a deterrent. If that's the case, why are the gangbangers not more afraid of being shot? Incindentally, how would a gun in a beach bag save a poor child accidentally caught in the crossfire of MS-13 & Liberty City gang members? Chicago doesn't need more guns- there are enough here hurting kids already. The neighborhoods where you claim citizens supposedly require extra means of self defense actually require better schools for their kids and jobys for unemployed youth and adults to succeed in life instead of falling into gang/thug life where weapons/death at a young age are a part of life.
In case you missed it, Chicagoans and the people from Illinois can already own guns legally. The supreme court is pretty clear on that. So the problems you mention about children getting ahold of guns already exist, if a legal firearm owner does not follow the law and properly secure their weapon. You may not like it, but Americans have the right to keep and bare arms. Now the politicians of this pro-crime state have created legal exposure for the state by continuing to try and enforce an illegal law. When something is allowed in 49 states but not in one, and that is a protected right in the Constitution, it becomes pretty hard to defend that law in court. Now Illinois is facing at least 2 lawsuits on this topic, which will cost the state millions to defend. The outcome is pretty obvious, so Illinois people will be granted the right to Concealed Carry, and it will be on the court's terms, instead of the Illinois legislature as an extension of the will of the people. I used to be uninformed on these issues, but then I was a victim of violent crime in Chicago on more than one occasion. It changed my thoughts. I learned how to safely handle a firearm, took multiple classes, and spend time at a range practicing. Once CC is passed in Illinois, I will probably chose to get a permit.
--Statistics are always open to interpretation, I have a collegiate level statistics background, how about yourself? The point is that the pro gun groups have made their data open to the public, where the anti gun groups have not. It's foolish to blindly believe any statistics without knowing the source of the data, such as Quinn has. In response to "kids and guns" issue: --Irresponsible gun ownership is a separate issue from "concealed carry" and it's fairly typical of anti gun liberals to lump the 2 together. Interestingly enough most of the "accidental" shootings of children and family members are caused by gang members, so to lump gang related violence in with law abiding citizens owning guns is hardly appropriate. (You will notice that the Brady Campaign no longer cites the statistic about being X number of times more likely to harm a family member than an intruder if you have a gun in the house--this is because the data came from gang violence and has no merit when it comes to law abiding citizens.) In response to the "gang banger" reference: --You are misrepresenting the kind of violent crime concealed carry prevents. Concealed carry prevents crimes perpetrated directly against innocents, robbery, rape, murder etc. not illegal gang crossfire. Chicago's gun problem: --Chicago has too many guns in the hands of gang members and not enough in the hands of law abiding citizens. Don't combine the two.
Yes, the pro-gun crowd certainly does publish their statistics. Whether or not they are pulled out of their posterior region is the pressing issue. Like you said- "open for interpretation". IMHO the fascist Brady camp stopped using that mantra in their campaign because they realize a significant segment of the vote they wish to capture will wake up and realize it's somewhat hypocritical to endorse guns and also supposedly be pro-family. There are some good points on the following site which express a lot of the frustration I feel with the pro-gun crowd who want to let their 2nd amendment right trump common sense. The likelihood that a handful of folks might deter a criminal act should not factor higher than the much more numerous accidental death & injuries to children stemming from the increased presence of firearms in society. http://www.parentkidsright.com/html/guns2.html
================== And there you go. When you ask a dog if his own shit smells good he'll tell you 'yeah' and take a bite. Brady hive mind drones of course will say people dont want guns because BRADY doesnt want guns. Fire this incompetent Quinn now...
================= Uh...Pedro is it?......CC is NOT meant to STOP GANGS from killing EACH OTHER. Comprende? CC is for US to protect US FROM them. Heres some basic facts for ya.... 1. CC has not CAUSED INCREASE in violent crime. The FBI stats show DECREASING violent crime rates during the same timeframe that many states have adopted CC laws. Sorry about your luck if you cant accept it. 2. The evidence doesnt PROVE increase or decrease in violent crimes BECAUSE of CC laws. It cannot be proven either way. 3. There are THOUSANDS upon THOUSANDS of ARMED SELF DEFENSE accounts ALL OVER the internet. So regardless of whether NUMBERS/STATISTICS are affected by CC laws, what IS affected is the INDIVIDUAL ability to defend ones life. And folks....THAT is what CONCEALED CARRY is ABOUT !
1) If YOU personally owned and carried a gun would you be contributing to violent crime. 2) Does YOU personally NOT owning or carrying a gun contribute to lower violent crime statistics? If you answered 'yes' to either of those questions I submit that you have just admitted to being a potential felon. Maybe its best for the REST of us that you not ever own ANY object you can harm another human being with. If you answered 'no' to both of those questions then you have just destroyed your own pathetic Brady reasoning because there is NO valid reason for you not to own and carry a gun (once its legal for you to do so). So...which is it...yes or no ?
===================== Now this is just completely bullshit. 1. There are tens of THOUSANDS of armed self defense accounts all over the web. They are FAR MORE numerous than the number of accidental deaths and injuries.....FAR more...astronomically so....you can lay off the exaggeration. 2. Normal every day gun 'nuts' accept and want TRUE 'common sense' laws. If you pull you head out of your rectum long enough read I believe you will find out that the NRA SUPPORTED background checks for gun sales as long as they do not infringe on the rights of the law abiding. Learn a FACT or two...you'll be much happier....
================== Regrettably this is how it goes most of the time. Guys like Pedro blame guns for the crime then something happens to them or someone they love and they are completely unable to do anything and at the mercy of some nutjob. Afterward they realize the horrible truth...their wife and children.....or their parents...might still be alive if they had been able to shoot the slimebag criminal dead before he shot them. ==Luby 's survivor Suzanna Hupp== http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9NDnqS5h9k&feature=related
First of all thank you for an intelligent, well thought out letter. Many of the pro gun folks on this board come across as uneducated, name calling 3rd graders. I disagree with your position, but I do appreciate you making it with out calling people names or categorizing someone who is against concealed carry as a liberal nut. My main problem with concealed carry is that i have seen evidence that some states are not maintaining their data very well. People convicted of a felony after getting a permit are not necessarily having their permits pulled. I also question how a person with 2 misdemeanors which were felonies and plead down in court still gets to carry. These were violent crimes. Self policing is another issue. I read a Smith and Wesson blog where concealed carriers were plotting how to carry guns into Disney World. Its apparently done everyday. Disney has a special and obvious exclusion in Florida. I get the feeling that some (not by any means all) people think having a concealed carry permit gives them the right to protect others, break the rules and generally have the 'power' over others. Zimmerman comes to mind. Rusty too. Just because 49 States have it does not mean that poorly controlled States with reciprocity don't impact States that take CC seriously. Until there's better control and evidence of a desire for real self control, I'm against it.
===================================================================== hmmmmm. So YOUR assessment is that if a FELON's permit is revoked that FELON will OBEY the law now and not carry a gun? Really? Youre THAT ignorant ?
===================================================================== Does that state law there say the signs supersede the law? In SOME states the 'no guns' signs do not carry the weight of law...ie they are meaningless.
======================================================================== 1. You dont know me, puke. 2. I'll be CERTAIN to make sure if some nut comes in with a gun and starts shooting at random to NOT save your sorry ass. I WILL keep your family safe as much as possible but your ass is on your own.
===================================================================== Who cares what youre against? Your sort has been bi#$hing about CC for decades and NONE of your doomsday BS never comes to pass. Illinois WILL become a CC state within 12 months and NOTHING will happen contrary to your Brady rhetoric and scary bedtime stories....just like it hasnt happened in any other state where CC has passed. Just like with murdering, raping COPS, some nuts slip thru the cracks. It'll always happen. Just like some people who cant drive worth a $#@T slip thru and get a drivers license.
http:// en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illinois_gubernatorial_election,_2010 This shows you werent elected by anything other than Chicago style politics no one in this state voted for you except the Fags and crooks in cook county, You are a Governor with out a state. Second of all how can you say with respect to laws and then try to legislate away the Constitution the Supreme Law of the land? Hipocracy! The Supreme Court ruled everyone has a right to self defense and not just in the home, how dare you speak about "With respect to laws." All I have to say is the Supreme Court says my Rights do not stop at my door so Quinn if you want me to fallow Illinois law you better give me some law to fallow or keep your mouth shut about the .45 on my side.